Here's Paul Martin. And Raimondo the roadie. Oh, your name is Raimondo now.

Yeah, I'm trying to become a little more international. I see. I see.

Okay. And why is this? Well, we do have an international audience. Oh, I see.

So I could be Pablo. You could be Pablo Martín. Pablo Martín.

That's right. Hey, okay. So who are we? This is Pablo Martín.

And Raimondo the roadie. For the Rock and Roll Chicago podcast. I think.

Yes. Yeah, I think it is. I don't know how to say that in a different language.

Well, I'll have to look it up on my iPhone translator. How to say rock and roll? Rock and roll Chicago podcast. Yeah.

So speaking of international celebrities, I think we've got one this week, don't we? We sure do. Coming from that little old band called TW4. Well, he wasn't quite with TW4.

I don't think he was even born yet. No, I don't think so either. But he has been playing with sticks for about 25 years.

Yes, he has. And his name is Todd Zuckerman, drummer extraordinaire for sticks and for Ryan Wilson and you name it. I tell you, he's got a whole list of characters that he's played with.

Yes, he has. He played with a ton of them. Before he was with sticks, he did a lot of session work with a lot of people.

And since then, he's been playing quite a bit and keeping very busy. And he's got a new album out as well. He does have a new album.

His debut album, actually. Yes. Of his very own.

Would that make him a debutante? I don't think so. No? Okay. No.

No. But let's find out what Todd Zuckerman is all about. And let's get to it right now.

Let's do it. Hey, welcome to the show, everyone. Today we're talking with the man who is probably best known for being the drummer of sticks, Chicago's own, Todd Zuckerman.

How are you today, Todd? I'm doing good, gentlemen. How are you doing? Thanks for having me today. Thanks for having us.

It's quite an honor. Thanks for being here. I'm here.

I have to be somewhere. I can be here with you guys. There you go.

So, I know you've got a new album out. You've got a lot of accolades and a lot of awards and what have you. We'll get to those.

But let's, if we could start out where it all started, back here in Chicago with your family. I know you came from a musical family. Can you tell us a little bit about how it all got started? I did.

I was born in Michael Reese Hospital and I grew up in Lincolnwood. And my parents met in New Orleans in a musical situation where my father was the band leader and my mother was in the show. But my father had a successful practice.

He was a prominent podiatrist in the city for decades. So he could only do so much road work because he had a practice. He was one of the drummers at the Chaperie night club for about 18, 19 years, which was like the Cotton Club of Chicago, so to speak.

So he played luminaries galore. So it was really kind of the best card to be dealt in life to grow up the youngest in a musical family with two older brothers. My oldest brother, Paul, still is a professional musician, gravitated to the piano when he was not much more than an infant and as did my brother, Joel.

But when it became clear that the drums were going to be what I was going to be doing, he switched to bass and rounded out a rhythm section. So that's pretty much how we grew up. We'd go for a swim, we'd throw a ball around, and then we'd go work on music.

And there was always music coming from everyone's rooms in the living room or the kitchen. And it was, you know, whether it was Beethoven or Led Zeppelin or, you know, whatever, the radio of the 1970s, you know, everything, Count Basie, The Beatles, I mean, name it, like a wide array of stuff. So that was great to grow up with that diverse taste and versatility to try to play all these different kinds of music.

It was a wonderful card to be dealt. Did you have any formal, like, training? You know, did you go to drum school when you were a kid or did you learn from your dad? I learned from my father. I mean, he taught me how to read and, you know, the basic beats.

And then, you know, I was always practicing and listening to music. And I was invited into the junior high jazz band and symphonic band when I was in first grade. So I have the dubious honor of spending eight years in the junior high school band program.

Wow. So that helped, you know, with my education and with my ears and, you know, being in a jazz band, a pit band and then everything that came with that. I didn't really take any other lessons other than my high school in Isles West and Skokie had a great music program, great fine arts program, great jazz band, marching band, drum line, blah, blah, blah, you know, down the line.

But it wasn't really until I went to Berklee College of Music for one year that I sort of had any formal instruction on the drums. And there are several teachers there that had a profound effect on me. Ian Froman, Skip Hayden.

And then I studied privately in Boston with Gary Chafee, who was a renowned teacher that taught the likes of Vinnie Cagliuta and Steve Smith and Jonathan Mover and many, many others. So that was really it. Sort of ran out of money.

My parents had split and there was some, you know, financial hard times there for a bit. And so I only knew I was going to go to Berklee for one year. So I made the most of it and came back to Chicago not knowing what was going to be in store for me.

So you, I know you played with your brothers when you were younger and then you played with the junior high and then in high school and all that. But were there any bands that you were a member of? Actual performing bands? Oh, God, I've probably forgotten more than I actually remember. I mean, yeah, because when, you know, when you're a musician and you dedicate your life and even, you know, to backtrack for a second, I mean, I never thought about do I want to do this or is this something I want to do? And I never wanted to be an astronaut or a fireman or, you know, a football player or whatever.

I always knew that I was going to do this. So you get a certain headspace where you just know that the whole thing is a journey. The whole thing is a continuum of every experience and every gig, even if you show up and you're playing someone's 50th wedding anniversary and you're playing waltzes and polkas all night.

There's something to be learned. There's some experience. There's something to be had by doing it and being there that goes beyond just making a couple of dollars.

So I always sort of treated everything like that. It doesn't mean I was always happy to be in certain places. But, you know, you can get around any hardships with the way that you look at it and deal with it and process it.

But I played with my brothers for years and years. And from the ages of 13 to 19, I spent every summer playing at a resort in Ellicott Lake, Wisconsin. But that was really the greatest education that I had, playing six nights a week in this, you know, like a Catskills old-timey resort.

It was a Victorian resort with a proper nightclub and lights and, you know, a proscenium stage and a dance floor. And in doing that six nights a week for six summers with older musicians, it was like the last bastion of, you know, comics that worked the old days and had books of music. And here's the Frank Sinatra impersonation medley.

So you're reading all these old charts from the 40s and 50s when you see other drummers' notes on there. That was, dare I say, a better education than my one year at Berkeley because that was real life experience. You know, you're playing with a horn band and you screw up, you play through a break or you don't set up the kicks.

You know, I'm 13, 14, 15 years old and I got guys in their 50s with their horns looking back at me like, you OK back there? You know, so that'll tune you up right quick. So that was really a great experience. And sadly, that's an experience that is largely not available to musicians now in this day and age.

I mean, COVID aside, you know, if we're having this conversation a year ago, that's something, you know, you don't walk into a resort in some small town in Wisconsin and see a seven piece band or a 13 or 14 piece band every night. So that was my best education. And I went right from there to Berkeley.

I came back after my one year at Berkeley and did my last summer there and tried to figure out and suss out what my game plan is in life and how to be more, how to grow my career other than just being very, very busy playing weddings and bar mitzvahs and stuff like that. You were a working musician, is what you were. And I think it's kind of changed over the years.

I know years ago, Beck, I'm a little bit older than you are, but Beck, you were in one band and that was it. But now you've actually extended that and gone through and played with whoever you could play with in order to gain experience. Well, that's how I knew that I could keep a busy schedule.

I knew if I could play jazz, you know, I might get some calls to do, to play with some jazz guys. Like I remember doing gigs with Orbit Davis and, you know, playing that type of jazz, you know, playing the Jazz Bulls with Harry Mira and a few other acts, playing in the Jazz Buffet. I mean, all these places that aren't there anymore, probably most of the places aren't there anymore.

Also doing rock stuff. I was a house drummer at the China Club for basically 92 to 93 for the Wednesday Night Pro Jams. Great bands that we had, you know, played with Michael McDermott for a bit and then playing the Park West and the Avalon and stuff like that, played the Metro.

So I mean, that's still there. Well, we'll see how many venues will survive this current situation. But, you know, I just knew that if I was diverse and was reliable, that my phone would ring and I would keep my schedule busy with all sorts of things.

To me, it was mental to put all your eggs in one basket with one band or like, hey, this is my rock band and we're trying to get the big record deal. Like I did that too and plenty of bands. But to dedicate myself solely to that and to put my future in the hands of three other knuckleheads, no friggin' way.

I mean, go buy a lottery ticket, go buy a lottery ticket. See what comes true first. You know, if I was reliable, kept a good reputation, showed up, prepared, nailed the gig, had the right gear for the gig, top notch sounding drums, was able to take direction, was able to please my employers.

I knew, you know, one day I'd be in a room with Sting or Peter Gabriel and both of those things happened. So, you know, that's how I tried to conduct my career and ultimately leave everybody happy that I was there. The world has enough, you know, curmudgeon, grumpy musicians, you know, complaining and bitching about everything.

Don't add to the pile. If you could be a breath of fresh air, then that might be... You're absolutely right. I mean, not to drop another name, but about two weeks ago, we talked with Mike Arturi.

Oh, yeah, yeah. And Mike said the same thing. He said, showing up on time, being a leader when you know when to be a leader and being a follower or a good soldier, as he called it, when to be that, you know.

I remember meeting Mike years and years ago and I was, you know, a little pipsqueaker, you know, right out of Berkeley. And he was playing with... Boy, he was doing like a jam night at the Traffic Jam, sat in there one night. And that's when I first met Mike, a guy that has to be 89, 88 or 89.

So you went out and you did some jingle work as well, correct? Well, that was really the goal at that time, because, you know, the cream of the crop musicians were the ones that were getting calls for the sessions. And that's really what I wanted to do. Um, when I graduated high school... Well, sorry, let me back up even more.

Somewhere in mid high school, I thought that when I turned 18, I just load up the car and I drive to California. And then I realized that maybe life isn't that way. Maybe I need some more experience.

I need to play here. And also, my father was aging and was in ill health. So that sort of kept another reason to keep me around.

So I just started doing some of the jingle stuff when it kind of like the last six months of my dad's life. To go back even further, I remember the first time I ever recorded it at Universal. I was... God, it was the summer in between seventh and eighth grade for me.

So that would have been, what, 82. And I remember walking in and the main session drummer at that time was a guy named Tom Radke. And I remember walking in the studio and on the side of the wall, there was all his stuff, his road cases and cymbal bags and with his name stenciled on them.

And to my 11, 12-year-old brain, whatever I was then, it didn't dawn on me that people could have more than one drum set or like you leave a set somewhere or someone hauls it for you. I knew like the who and stuff like that had, you know, that there were roadies. But when you're an individual musician, that was like... And right then and there, I was like, that's what I want to do.

I want to be that guy. The main session drummer in between Radke and myself is Jim Hines. And I remember having a conversation with him where he had a similar moment with Tom Radke where he saw him loading out of the Jazz Bulls and putting a floor tom in his Ferrari.

And Jim said, that's what I want to do. That's nice. So you moved on and I know when you joined Styx or actually you were called in first to do some work because Johnny Panazzo was ill, right? Correct.

How did that come about that you got the call? No, no, I didn't know any of those guys, although I had met JY socially twice, but there was no like schmoozings of anything like that. I loved Styx as a kid growing up. I saw him at the records.

It was just cool to meet him. I ran into JY outside of dress rehearsals, you know, Ogden and Grand, which was like the rehearsal place. And then I played a wedding where JY was one of the guests and he sat in with us.

So those are the first two times I met him. And, you know, it was fun, but didn't think anything of, you know, opportunistic about it by any stretch. It was just cool.

But Keith Marks ran his Carthage company was the Carthage company that took care of all the session musicians that were doing all the work in town, whether you were a drummer, you know, keyboards or guitars, whatever. It was his company. And Keith and I became really good friends, you know, working for a number of years together.

And, you know, he had the keys to my place and I would pile up all the stuff that, you know, I needed for the session. He would come at, you know, five, six o'clock in the morning, grab it, set it up, take it downtown, set it up. I'd go into the session, play, leave.

He'd tear it down and put it right back. And I became the guy that I wanted to become, you know, like there's my stuff piled somewhere, right? So Keith had worked with Styx in the past and he'd worked with a couple of guys on their solo projects. And I guess A&M Records wanted to release the definitive Styx greatest hits.

And Lady was on Wooden Nickel Records, another record label, and all the other big records were on A&M. And there was some whatever fun music business thing about attaining their rights to the original sound recording and another label, blah, blah, blah. So they decided, well, let's just rerecord that song.

So not only was that the impetus for everyone to sort of work for them for the first time in many, many years, but John Penaza was in ill health and really couldn't physically play the drums. And so they called Keith Marks and they said, who should we get to ghost drum for John? And Keith immediately suggested me, said that I saw the band growing up as a kid and I was a fan and that I would be the choice. So Keith picked me up and we drove down to Gary Loizo's Pumpkin Studios in Orland Park.

Hey, nice to meet you guys, blah, blah, blah. I saw you guys on the Paradise Theater tour, blah, blah, blah. And then it was time to get to work.

And I played, I was prepared. In my mind, anyway, the whole thing was maybe 90 minutes with sounds and playing it and making them happy. And then I left, you know, and then I was probably playing a wedding the next night or something like that, you know, doing a corporate party somewhere, doing something else.

And that was in March of 95. And then in February of 96, I got called by them again to do another song. A&M was going to release Greatest Hits Part Two.

They had two, I think two new original songs that they were going to do. And they had gotten John to play on one of them. There wasn't much drums on it.

It was very, very simple. And apparently, I never met John. But apparently by that point, he was pretty frail.

But they were able to get a performance out of him. And then there was a song called Little Suzy that was kind of co-written by Glenn Burtnick, which is sort of foreshadowing at that time. And it was a very aggressive rock song.

So, but I noticed that time, not that they weren't nice on my initial meeting, but there was a much more kind of get to know you questions and kind of like hanging out. And I could tell that they were sizing me up as a person. Because when you're in a band with someone, you know, there's 22 hours of the day that you're, you know, you have to spend in cars and Sprinter vans and airports and whatnot with.

So if I was a freak or a loon bag or a creep, you know, it wasn't going to work. So they, I could tell they were sizing me up. And I knew something was brewing.

And then, you know, left the session, kind of went home and, hmm, interesting. And in my mind, my memory, anyway, it's like two days later, James Young, JY called and basically said, we're going to go out and do a summer tour. Would you be interested in doing it? And if John gets better, the gig is his.

And I said, well, of course, absolutely. You know, I had never done a full scale rock tour at that point in my life, much less with a band whose records I had growing up. So it was pretty easy to say, yes, I hadn't had that experience.

But by that time, thankfully, I mean, I was doing really well in the studio. So like financially, it was sort of a lateral move. It was more for the experience of doing that.

And then John Penazzo, in hindsight, he was, he was critically ill. You know, it was unexpected that he passed away in the middle of the tour. And, you know, come to think of it, they never really told me I have the gig.

I've just been kind of hanging around for the last 24 years. Now, so you did play a little Susie, right? I did. And was the other song, It Takes Love or something? Yeah, that was, I think that was John's farewell.

Well, let me, let me ask you this. Now, on current stuff or stuff that you're playing now, like The Mission, how do I word this? Do you guys do it over the internet? Do you, do they send you files? Somebody writes a song and... Well, not with The Mission. We could actually get together in person back then.

But with this current record that I recorded, the drum tracks right here in June, that was all done virtually and digitally. I mean, the demos were very much, you know, Technicolor final drafts. And before COVID hit, I was scheduled to go to Nashville in April and record there.

You know, when COVID hit, I mean, I wasn't comfortable getting on a plane or going anywhere then. And I'm still not really. And I have this, I have a killer recording studio here.

I said, well, look, the technology exists. Let's do it here. I have a program on my studio setup here called Audio Movers Listen To, where my engineer, any engineer can drive my rig here from another location safely, you know.

So I'm the only one in the room. So I have my engineer driving the show here. Tommy and Willow Vankovich, the producer, were in their studios listening on an invite link with high resolution audio in their studios, just like they'd be listening to it if we were recording it.

And then we got on a Zoom call and I'd play it. And if, you know, someone said, could you play, you know, a different fill into the first chorus? I was like, sure. All right, JR, punch me in.

And boom. And we did 17 tracks in three days like that. I was well prepared to do the record because I was prepared to do it in April.

So by the time I did it in June, I was really frigging prepared, you know. So that is, that's being like mixed and mastered, I think, like right now. I mean, when will it come out? I do not know.

I'm never in charge or have anything to do with that aspect of what goes on with the band. But it's a killer, killer record. And whenever it does come out, I'll be very excited for it.

This is Paul Martin. And Ray the Roadie. And we're here to talk to you about GHS strings.

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And so tell us about your record now. Last slide on. This one here? This one? Yes, that one there.

That one there, yeah. Well, the whole thing came about completely, I don't want to say a fluke because that kind of has a negative connotation. An old buddy of mine, J.K. Harrison, who I had worked with in the past, was always harassing me and cajoling me about doing my own record with me singing.

And I always blew him off, you know, sort of with the notion that, hey, I think it's cute that you think I could do this. But I did not think I possessed the talent to be the singer. But he believed in me.

And he heard me sing before. And he's like, dude, you could totally do it. Just work with me.

We could absolutely do it. It's going to be great. You know, I always was attracted to the idea.

But again, I didn't think I had the chops to pull it off. Like, gee, I'd love to be an astronaut. Or, gee, I'd love to be a major league ball player.

You know, the way a kid thinks like that. Because I've always loved singing. I've always loved singers.

I've always loved melody. So it just hit me at a time when, well, also at the same time, I was in the house listening to the band Elbow. And the song Kindling came on from their Little Fictions record.

And my wife, who's a brilliant singer, she sang in Brian Wilson's band for 12 years. She turned to me and said, you'd sound great on this. If you ever do something, you should cover this song.

And it just kind of hit me at the same time when JK was hitting me. And I was about to be in Los Angeles for a week with a couple days off and a couple nights off. I didn't have all that much to do out there for the week.

So I thought, well, JK, let's get together. At the very least, we'll have a bunch of drinks and a bunch of laughs. You know, nothing comes of it.

No harm, no foul. And by the second day, I could tell things were just organically growing really, really quickly. And we wrote the song Last Flight Home together in a lightning round, 20 to 30 minutes back and forth, where it was a fully finished song in the form that you would hear it now.

It scared the hell out of me. Because I'm very comfortable behind the drums. I'm very comfortable in the back, hidden behind all the wood and metal.

And I'm very comfortable singing in a background capacity, especially with the guys in sticks. Do you do much singing with sticks? Yeah, not a lot, but some. Enough that if I were out of tune, I'd ruin it.

You know, so, yeah. And even going back to 96, I sang on some things. So the thought of being that vulnerable and out front was akin to that cliche nightmare where you're standing in front of the classroom in your underwear, the dream that you have, that type of thing.

It felt dangerous and vulnerable. And I started to go down a dark path for a moment of hearing all the internet like, Hey, Suckerman, what do you think? You're a big singing star now? Why don't you shut the hell up and get behind the drums? Back where you belong. You know, the litany of nastiness.

And, you know, once I kind of cleared that out, I said, no, you know what? The fact that this terrifies me, I think this is where I need to be. This is what I need to do. Because I'm seeing it through and I'm hearing it.

You know, after the first couple of sessions were a little rough and JK was like, listen to me, this is going to happen. It's going to be great. Just let me help you.

And then when it got to the point where I'm like, I can play this for people. And then when I played it to a few close confidence and they were freaking flabbergasted and blown away, they couldn't believe it. Then I thought, you know what? Okay.

All right. I'm on to something here. And it sort of gave me the courage to continue doing this.

But I didn't let many people in the entire world. My mom didn't even know. I didn't let many people in the world know that I was doing this because if I chickened out or if I didn't carry it through in the 11th hour, I didn't want to pay the price for it.

Then it's, hey, what's that record you've been working on, you know? Well, my hands off to JK for pushing you through because I watched the video on Last Flight Home and you did a great job singing. Thank you. That was fantastic.

Fantastic. Thank you. It was a colossal learning experience.

And my goal was to be able to stand behind every note, every sound, every lyric on that record and no music, no art is for everyone, but I'm not embarrassed of anything and no one can say something sucks. You might not like it, but it doesn't suck. And that's what I was trying to do.

If you like sophisticated pop, if you like bands like Elbow, Jellyfish, Crowded House, you might stand a chance of liking this because to me, it's all about the melody and connecting with the story of the lyric. And it's not a drum-centric record. It's supportive drumming.

And I was at first concerned about that because I think most people would expect some sort of drum-centric fusion record. But I liked the fact that it wasn't that. And I liked the fact that there was one song on there that's just piano and a string quartet and me singing.

There's not even any drums on there. A la Phil Collins, who's always been a huge inspiration to me and why he can sometimes be a punching bag is ridiculous. The guy is monumentally talented on so many levels, through so many genres, through so many decades.

The guy's a frigging hero. One of the greatest drummers ever. One of the greatest writers ever.

One of the greatest singers ever. You could Lou Reed me all you want, but I'm not buying it. So do you have the bug now for album number two? No.

That was a quick answer. I mean, I still am kind of getting over the fact that this thing exists in the first place. I mean, I never thought that this would ever happen.

So I have no aspirations to try to be some sort of singing celebrity. I'm very comfortable back there in my home cage. And I'm very happy with my place playing drums in the band.

But we'll see. As I couldn't have imagined this, I like not knowing and having a plan. I like having things sort of float to me, opportunities that materialize.

And I say yes or no. And I like to say yes more than I like to say no. But I can't say that I'm licking my chops to do another one because I'm still getting over the... The excitement? Well, no, the laborious birth.

And I mean that in a positive way. I mean that with all positivity. Like for me, when I do like a big project, no matter what it is, I can only imagine it's like the way a director feels on a movie.

Like I do a movie, and that's why you don't hear from... It's another three or four or five years until the guy directs another movie because you're still going... Yeah. You know, months and months. I like being involved, but to be involved with that heavy of a capacity where you're making a lot of decisions.

Someone comes to me and wants me to play on their record. That's fun. That's easy.

But when it comes time to do something like the two DVDs I did, my two wife's records, Taylor Mills that I produced, and this one, it's always many, many months long, sometimes over a year long period that is just focused on that. And then you have to turn it off. And you have to do other things.

And then it's, you know, Daddy, Daddy, okay, you know, life pulls at you in different ways. So I don't mind kind of having a little bit of a breather now that that was done. And who knows? Maybe if I do another record, maybe it will be that jazz fusion record 18 people will like.

So did you have a hand in the writing of all the material? Yes. JK did the lion's share because working with a guy like him is like walking into a museum of ideas and sections and completed songs or completed ideas. And you just go, okay, this is cool.

Like, I like this part. This part will go with this. Or what if we change, you know, what if we slow this down and make it a little, you know, all these different ideas.

One of the songs on there was, it's called She's Red Velvet. And JK's original demo idea was a very stripped down, like Roy Orbison, Chris Isaac type of thing. And I didn't have like this beautiful Roy Orbison, Chris Isaac falsetto things to keep sweeping up, but I could belt it out full voice.

And I thought, wouldn't it be like, let's take this and have a little bit of that flavor, kind of like it could have been in the HBO show True Blood. Sort of you're in some weird, creepy vampire club, but then it kind of builds up to like a Radiohead or Oasis, full like crunch guitar, full voice with harmonies type of thing. And so he would look at that and, you know, he had this very pretty Roy Orbison thing.

And I want to take it there. And it worked. And we did it.

And I'm glad we did. So there's a lot of things like that of changing arrangements. He had another song called Do You Know Me that was just piano and voice.

And I said, let's do a Brian Wilson-esque smile background vocal thing. And at first he had a hard time with it because it's such a personal, the idea of the song is a very personal thing. And we did that.

We added a string quartet. And it all of a sudden, it took on that kind of Brian Wilson shape, but it didn't lose the one on oneness or the gravity of what the song is trying to convey. So there's a lot of collaborations like that.

But the one song that we wrote totally from scratch that didn't exist, nothing existed before, was the title track Last Flight Home. It's a great, great, what I heard of it so far. I've listened to the whole thing.

But it's a great album so far. Very good. Definitely.

Most definitely. I was gonna say, speaking of Brian Wilson, and I know you played with Brian Wilson. You played live with him as well on many of his recordings, correct? What was that experience? Well, that experience was really magical for me on many levels.

I played on, appeared on five of his records. There's only one I did the entire thing. That's That Lucky Old Sun.

But I did his first ever solo tour, which is really sort of like 10 dates total. But between a couple different weeks. But I worked with a singer named Taylor Mills through Steve Cole, a saxophone player that's from Chicago.

And I met her in October of 98 playing with Steve when his Smooth Jazz record went number one on Atlantic Records back then in those days. Joe Thomas was producing Brian at that time. And Brian had a house in St. Charles.

Right. And then Brian was going to go do these 10 dates or whatever it was. And Joe asked me, he said, hey, do you know a female singer in Chicago that's beautiful and is an amazing singer? And I said, yeah, actually, I just worked with this singer, Taylor Mills.

So long, long, long, long, long story short, the month of rehearsals or three weeks, whatever it was, that we rehearsed every day at Brian's place. That's when Taylor and I were recording. And I was immediately smitten with her.

I fell in love with her before she fell in love with me. That's to fall in love and end up with the woman that has been my wife for that we've been together for 21 years. Falling in love with Brian's music as the soundtrack was pretty magical.

Yeah. So that will always have a very, very special place in my heart and that music and those people and those times. And that was March of 99 and then June of 99.

And then Styx picked up again in late July of 99. So I had to leave the organization. And Jim Hines followed.

It preceded me in the drum chair there for many years. And I went back with Styx. But Brian would still call me from time to time to play on the records, which I was very grateful to be doing.

And yeah, and my wife carried on for another 12 years in that organization. But like many things, bands evolve and people go in and people go out. And that's show business.

Well, I know you've played with a number of celebrities or stars or individuals, including Peter Cetera and Michael Bolton and several others. But I have to ask you about Spinal Tap. What would you like to know? How crazy was that? How much fun was that? It was a firing squad of comedy to be in their presence.

First off, they're all great people. They also all can play. And they're also very serious about wanting to play to the best of their ability.

It'd be very easy to think that they're a millionaire personality and TV stars and movie stars. And they're just doing this as a lark. But they really want to play as well as they can.

They're committed to it, right? They're into it. But they're all just stellar people. And I'm envious of Greg Bissonnette, who played way more with them than I did, because just to spend that much time with quality people that are that funny, that take care of you, that are very considerate and they're lovely human beings.

It's just really, really great. And there's a couple of jokes that I really can't tell here that I always hold dear. It's a couple of my favorite jokes.

They're not for public consumption. But I just wrote about the other day and posted. The first time I played with them was just 20 years ago on October 4th.

We did Stonehenge on The Tonight Show, complete with the little people and the 18-inch monument that came down. And we had only rehearsed one song, and I knew it was Stonehenge. But C.J. Vanston was the musical director, and he was really the guy that called me to do it.

And so we're in our green room, and it's, you know, places, you know, guys go down. And I'm getting up on the drum riser, and I see taped on top of my snare drum head is a piece of paper that says, set list, one, Stonehenge. And I was just frigging dying.

I had to wherewithal to take that piece of paper and set it aside and go, I'm, that's coming home with me. And that's been in a frame, you know, on the wall of my office ever since for 20 years. But just, I mean, I don't know what to say.

It's, they're just absolutely hysterical. I did Jimmy Fallon. I did Jon Stewart's Daily Show.

We did Funky Sex Farm 2000 and Give Me Some Money. We did Back from the Dead. So I got to play these different songs with them.

And, you know, when you see them, they're them. And they look like they could be, you know, your dentist or something like that. And then they go to wardrobe, and they come out, and it's like, it's the guys, you know? There's a spinal tap.

Absolutely, absolutely brilliant. Any chances of a reunion? They're doing something tonight for a political fundraiser for the state of Pennsylvania. I don't know if it's just like sort of a table read or an interview.

I don't think that they're, it's like I'm doing a show. And I highly doubt that they'd all even be together. It'll be probably reading like this.

But no, that's the last time that they ever played was when we did the Daily Show, which would have been in July of 2009. I don't think those guys have played like a full band thing. So you're playing next week with the HE Band and Seth Meyers, correct? Yeah, so I'll be playing drums with the HE Band October 19th through the 22nd next week.

And it's fun. I mean, I had a great experience when I did that in person two years ago. What, guys, is it two years ago? It's gonna be two years coming up in December.

And the fun thing about doing that... So you're doing it virtually, correct? Yeah, right here. Okay. The fun thing about doing that show for me, like not being a New York guy, obviously, is, you know, you get flown to New York, you stay at a hotel right around the corner.

And it's like this little New York fantasy where like, it's like I live in New York and I've got a gig at 30 Rock, you know, and you see when walking to work in Manhattan, you know, it was December, it was cold, all the Christmas stuff was up. Walking to work is the big, you know, Christmas tree at Rockefeller Plaza. You go in and, you know, there's like the page like, Hi, Norm, you know, Hi, Phil, you know, and you go in and like, it's you have a job in New York for a couple days.

And it's great. And then it's over like that. But I'd love to do that again, because it's just this delicious little New York fantasy for a moment.

I don't think that I could ever live in New York. I kind of like peace and quiet. That's why I'm out in the hill country here a little bit.

But I'm Austin adjacent, you know, but I've always fantasized about the Manhattan, the New York musician, you know, it was cool to get a little taste of that. So when was the last time Stix was out on tour? When is the last show you guys did? The last show we did was in maybe the third week of February. We played Mardi Gras in New Orleans.

And I have to, I'll confess something. I really hope that our band can play another show. And that, you know, the world would be safe to let us do that.

Because that's not how I want to end 24 years in that band with that gig. The gig started at one o'clock in the morning. I had a 6 a.m. flight.

I was already on the plane, you know, playing the gig in my mind. It was like, let's do this. And I'm normally not like that when it comes to gigs.

But that gig was, again, everybody was hammered. And it wasn't like, you know, a real, real show. It was playing a big, you know, booze-soaked party.

And I had a flight to catch. I don't want to go out like that. So since then, now, everybody's been quarantining because of this whole COVID thing.

Are the zombie hands quarantining too? Oh, yeah. Yeah, the zombie hands are waiting for a vaccine so I can... Terrorize people. I'm going to terrorize Lawrence because I never know where the hands are going to go.

It could go right... I'm going to stick my hand in the curtain and go... Where did that ever come from? I just made it up, I think. One night, you know, you have a couple cocktails and then, you know, Lawrence would go to bed early and I'm nowhere near... Like, I'm having another pop here. And, you know, I would never do it when he was like full on sleeping.

but like maybe about five to eight minutes, maybe 10 minutes, when he's in there, when he's just sort of resting. And then, because if you've ever, ever been on a tour bus, you know, the bunks have like a sliding, like a heavy mat, but you can reach underneath and it's like you're reaching underneath the curtain. And when you do that, all the little slats that it's connected to also kind of make noise.

So it's even worse. It adds more terror, just the hands coming in and you hear the clickety-clack of this heavy mat. Yeah, it's very, very violent and unsettling.

And, you know, of course, you're enjoying it. I wouldn't do it to someone who had the power to fire me. So that's why I like doing it to Lauren.

So congratulations on your many accolades with Modern Drummer. I know you've been voted number one progressive rock drummer and classic rock drummer and a number of other awards. But now you've also got your Methods and Mechanics DVD that you've done.

And you are an educator. Are you still teaching? Yes, I'm still teaching. I mean, with the two Methods and Mechanics DVDs, I also did, which is still available, something called Rock Drumming Master Class for Drumeo.

And Drumeo is one of the premier online drum education websites. And that is about 15 hours long, 26 episodes, 15 songs, 15 play-alongs, assignments for beginners, intermediate and advanced drummers for each station. Incredible technology with slow motion or speed control.

You can go faster or slower. And that was a very, very successful thing that came out in 2018. It's still available.

But when those packages first came out, you had access to me as your teacher. So I had 3,000, the first edition was 3,000 drummers that were all on a form. They could email me or send me a clip or go like this, or is this, you know, am I holding the stick correctly or whatever? And I had to contractually spend about 15 hours a week answering questions, mentoring students.

And it was a blast doing that. And you had a fantasy camp too, part of a fantasy camp. Was that through Drumeo as well? No, that was through Steve Orkin at Drum Fantasy Camp.

He did it in Chicago for a number of years. And I did that in 2017 and 2018. And he was going to move it out to Los Angeles this year, but COVID hit and, you know, that's c'est la vie.

Now I have one question for you. With Sticks, do you guys do your own soundchecks? Does your drum tech do your soundcheck? Good question. For years, we never soundchecked.

We only soundchecked if someone had an issue and we needed to, you know, check the sound. Someone's having a problem, let's fix something. And somewhere along the way, Tommy got into the habit of where he felt good that if he sang a bit that late afternoon.

So after being conditioned to not soundcheck for, you know, 16, 17 years, then I had to be in the condition to soundcheck every day for the last several years. Can't say it's my favorite thing to do. Me neither.

I'm getting older, you know, it's like I'm a pitcher. Like I only have so much of this in me. So I don't, I like to save it for the show.

I like to warm up really strongly and then, you know, save it for the show. Now, if someone's having a problem, you know, of course we need to fix that. Or if we're working on something, you know, like when we do, you know, we had two shows that were canceled in March because of the health crisis, of course.

But we were going to do the mission, the whole record in its entirety at the Beacon Theater in Manhattan and then at the Warner Theater in Washington, D.C. So when there's things like we haven't played certain songs in a while, or someone wants to work something new into the set, those soundchecks are always imperative. But just to play, for me, just to play Fooling Yourself, I try to save it for the show. Have you ever missed a six gig and have somebody who's sitting in your place? Yes, I did.

I had been asked to and committed to doing a Modern Drummer Festival in 2008. And back then, that was kind of like the Academy Awards for drummers. It's already in print.

I'm in there. Anyway, long story short, I wanted to honor my commitment. The band had just done a bunch of charity shows where Kenny Arnoff was the house drummer.

So they called, they never asked me to call Kenny. And I'm like, well, Kenny's a pro. He's going to write everything out.

And he did. And he came to a show and I spent, you know, two hours on the phone with him one night preparing him to go do the show when I went and did the Modern Drummer Festival, which the Modern Drummer Festival was a, for my box office in the drum world, was a huge thing that I did that. There's many people that never even heard of me until that event.

So that was, it was clear to me, and I knew I cannot miss this. And I can't be bereft of having the experience of being there for the whole weekend and hanging out with everybody. I didn't want to just jet in, exhausted, and then do my bit or have to leave, say thank you very much, you know, and then, you know what I mean? I wanted to have that experience.

And I'm so glad that I did. And then when my daughter was born, she was due in late February. And then the doctor said, we need to, we need to get her out now.

Not now as in now, but like next Friday now. So thank goodness Kenny was available to do, he subbed four dates, I think, for me. He was able to do the shows.

I was able to fly home and have the experience of being present for the birth of my only, our only kid who we never thought we would have this late in life. I was not going to miss that for anything. And so those are the only gigs that I ever missed.

But I played gigs with food poisoning and salmonella and, you know, being sick as hell. And, you know, that's the show must go on. So, so where can people find you on Facebook or social media or on a website or whatever? We have ToddSuckerman.com. That's T-O-D-D-S-U-C-H-E-R-M-A-N for you keeping score at home.com is the Todd Suckerman artist page, Instagram, and I have a YouTube channel.

So you can, you can find me. I'm, I'm floating around in the air at all times. And the album's available on your website? The album's available, you know, the hard copies are available only at my website.

I think, you know, it might be available at CD Baby and Amazon now. I think, I think it's available there now, but it's also all your digital platforms and iTunes and. Well, thank you so much for being with us today, Todd.

And it's been a pleasure talking with you. It's fun to talk to some, some Chicago brothers. Thanks for having me on.

Stay safe. Enjoy some Lou Malnati's and some Vienna beef, which I have flown in as much as I can. I miss it.

I miss it so, but I'm so glad I don't. If I lived in Chicago, I think I'd be about 600 pounds because I just, I love the food so much. Well, I'll be in Dallas this weekend.

Maybe I'll bring down a Lou Malnati's. We'll meet halfway. I actually have some in the freezer.

There you go. Thank you very much. A pleasure.

Take care. Thank you, Todd. Thank you.

So that was Todd Zuckerman, drummer extraordinaire with, with Styx. Everybody knows him from Styx, I would say, but he's got many accolades as well with Modern Drummer Magazine. He's internationally known like me.

Like you, Raimondo. That's right. I'm Raimondo.

I'm available for a gig anywhere in the world. Are you Raimondo-ing people that you are? I'm going to remind Raimondo's you that I am available for, for parties, bar mitzvahs, weddings. Well, there you go.

Hire Ray, Raimondo. Gotta keep a different name that we know for tax purposes. I see.

I didn't know Mondo was your last name. Raimondo. Raimondo, yes.

Actually, my last name's The Roadie. It is. That's right.

So yeah, that was a good, that was a good interview with Todd. He had a lot to say. Yes, he did.

It was, it was great talking with him. It was very entertaining. Well, I hope all of you were entertained by it as well.

Thanks for listening, everybody. And be sure and check us out. Where can they find us? They can find us on Facebook.

They can find us on our website, rockandrollschagelpodcast.com. You can find us on Twitter. You can find us on Instagram. You can find us on TikTok, unless somebody's forced them to shut down.

You can find us on iTunes. You can, you know what, if you can find a podcast somewhere, we're there. Actually, we are now on Amazon Podcasts just recently.

Yeah, we got accepted for Amazon Podcasts. So check us out there. All right.

Well, thanks for listening, everybody. We'll see you next week. We'll bring you another exciting show.

Adios, amigos. Adios, amigos.