Coming to you from the studios at the Illinois Rock and Roll Museum on Route 66, it's the Rock and Roll Chicago podcast. Hey, everybody, it's Ray the Roadie. And this is Hollywood Mike with another glorious episode.

Another glorious episode on a warm November night. Warm November night. That's right.

It's raining and I'm lucky enough to be able to still be able to ride a motorcycle, but I was stupid. That's right, in a thunderstorm. You're going to have fun.

Yeah, it's going to be a lot of fun. I have one shirt and luckily it's cotton, so it'll absorb and soak me to the bone. Or we can find you a hefty garbage bag.

Yeah, we could do that. We could probably do that. Cut a hole in it, put it on.

Yeah, that may actually be kind of fun. Yeah, I've done that before. Yeah, it works.

You get caught. Yeah, it helps for a little while. Yeah, absolutely.

So we have a guest that's been here before. He knows us. He knows all the shenanigans and everything that's about to happen.

He was here with Two Beer Tommy. That's right. Gosh, how long ago was that? Oh, more than two beers ago.

It might have been a year or two ago. Yeah, yeah. So tell everybody who you are.

Well, my name is Rich. I'm a Sagittarius. Oh, perfect.

Yeah. With the band Wildwood, Wildwood Country. Wildwood Country.

Yes, sir. More upper. You can bring it up.

Yes, bring it right up there. Yeah, let me make it light. Anyway, Rich Sagittarius, Wildwood Country.

Right, right. Which is kind of a concept thing like Two Beer Tommy was actually. Yeah, yeah.

And do you like long walks on the beach and pina coladas? And playing guitar, long walks on the beach. Exactly right. All that.

Yeah, I don't think we're supposed to get along, though, because I'm a Scorpio. Scorpio and Sagittarius, I don't think they get along. I don't know.

I'm a Leo. I'm the top of the line. Well, actually, I'm a Cancerian.

I just love how Sag says that. Yeah, Leo's the top of the heap, man. No, I think you're just a big pussy.

So you guys wanted dates? Yeah, now it's become a dating podcast. Yeah, yeah. Well, we were talking about band mix.

That's, you know, in the last podcast, that's kind of tender for musicians. And I thought that was like cake mix or something. Yeah, exactly.

Yeah. So Wildwood Country. Yes.

Wildwood Country. So take us back. How did this whole thing come about and start for you? Well, let's talk about the divorce and then what happened with the kids and then how we moved on, right? Yeah, yeah.

So Two Beer Tommy, great band, great bunch of people. But I've got a vision. And probably a lot of people come here and sit in these seats do, you know, I get this vision that I want to play a certain style and in a certain way.

And that's what makes me alone in this world. People share my vision because it takes a lot of work. You know what I mean? And not everybody gets along, right? So with Two Beer Tommy, they did not necessarily want to do the same amount of work that I was doing, though we did a lot of work and played around a lot.

So, you know, we were at a show and all of a sudden I realized, well, this is it. This is as far as this is going to go. So, you know, Nick joined the band, came in great musicians.

So I'm like, OK, this is a good time to bow out and I'm going to start a new thing, right? Same concept, though. But Wildwood Country and Wildwood is just about and you might be familiar with Wildwood Guitars, right? So that's company. But everybody, for the most part, has got wood in their hands at some time or another, right? Since I was 12 years old.

So I'm not going to go there. But yeah, drummers got wood, you know, everybody's holding wood, right? You know, so but when it's all coming together, you know, when it gets wild, then, you know, that's what Wildwood is all about. Right.

But it's more of a concept and not about who's in the band. It's about this vibe that you're going to come and see. Because if you ever look at our stuff, you'll see no two shows have the same two people because I just book.

I just say yes. OK. So then I get who's available.

Hey, what are you doing next week? You know what I'm saying? So it's wild that way, too. But it's going to be the same vibe, you know, line dancers, people singing along, same kind of music, you know, and a lot of great players, you know, which makes it a lot of fun for me because I get to play with a lot of people. So so this wasn't really a difference in like musical concept.

No, not at all. You're still doing the same kind of music and, you know, probably a lot of overlap from from two maybe about 50 percent overlap, more country than kind of classic rock. You know, a lot of the country bands around here and God bless them all.

I just played with one at Bob City Saturday night and a lot of people do the same shtick where they do some 90s country. They do some old school country a little bit, and then they do the classic rock. Right.

Right. You know, so but this band does no classic rock. It does either old country or new country, you know, but not the new 90s country stuff that people kind of like to dance to.

So you tend to stay away from that line where you start to cross into southern rock or whatever. But the closest we get to it is we will take a song, for example, I Want You To Want Me. Right.

Great Illinois classic song. Everybody loves to sing along at Cheap Trick, but Dwight Yoakam does a killer version of it. So we play.

Oh, sure. We play with Dwight Yoakam. So we'll do country versions of those songs that people will sing along and dance to.

Right. But we're not going to do the Cheap Trick version and nothing against my brothers. I mean, I love those guys.

Right, right, right, right, right. So I guess I'm so so I'm just trying to get a grasp on the concept here. So what was the thing that was missing there for you? They weren't playing enough for you.

Wild. I mean, the two beer guys. Yeah, yeah.

Well, you know, I wear people out pretty fast. OK, all right. I wear you guys out before this is out.

Right. So what happens is it just gets to a point where people get tired. You know what I mean? And then they just kind of do the same thing.

But nobody wants to elevate it to like what I call like a next level. Like that band got to a level where it was just about ready to do some fests and do some stuff. Right.

But you can be a great player. Right. And I play with a lot of great players.

Many of them play circles around me. In fact, almost all of them do. But when a band has got a little certain something, you know what I mean? It takes more than just being a great player.

You know, like you've got to bring a little something to the show. You can play circles around. But if you're staring at your feet.

Right. You know, what does that do? You can't get people motivated. I know I work with a lot of artists who I don't think are very good players at all.

But man, can they move people? And we've all seen that. Yeah. Yeah.

You know what I'm saying? And so, you know, it's kind of where you're at. And as some people get to a point where they're just like, ah, do we got to do this again? Or, you know, I look at even shows that maybe there's three people at is a paid rehearsal. And I'm so happy to be there.

I'm going to play like Madison Square Garden. Right, right, right. And the next guy, next thing is gone.

Oh, this is bullshit. Yeah, there's nobody here. But, you know, did they work in bringing anybody there? No.

You know, they're not lifting a finger to do anything. All they're going to do is complain. So you can check off some boxes, sing good, play good.

Yeah. Can you handle your equipment? Right. Not really.

You know, can you do this? Can you smile? No. You know, those kind of things start to happen. So what was the thing that happened for you that made you think, OK, you know, Wildwood is where I want to be? What kind of stuff kind of set the green light off for you, I guess? Well, again, I wanted to work towards that next level.

And, you know, I don't want to be disrespectful, but I'm a whore. So I get a lot of offers for shows. Right.

And I don't like to say no. So I say yes to almost everything. That's not maybe not good.

But there's a lot of places I love to play. I love playing carols. I love playing Bob City played the other night.

You know, I love Saddle Up. I love line dance. I'm addicted to line dancers.

I don't know why. And I'm a classic rocker by trade, you know, but something happens in the country thing, you know, that I just love how the people enjoy that music, you know, so. And they can line dance to anything, can't they? Don't even classic rock.

I know it's crazy. However, and line dancers are serious about that shit. Yeah, they are.

And that's really a key point, because the thing is, if you don't think about tempo and you don't think about, you know, the beats and stuff like that, you can speed things up and get like a live vibe, but it screws up the dancers, right? You really need to think. And so it's I got to tell you, it's a hell of a conversation with a drummer. I go, OK, great.

We're going to start. I just like a click. I'd like you to click me in with the tempo, but I'm not locked in that we're going to play to a track or you're going to play to the click.

I still like the the motion of the music a little bit. You know what I'm saying? But when we go from a fast song to a slow song and that song is this beat. Right.

We should be starting to that beat. If you let the guitar player start, forget about it. Yeah, you're off to the races.

That's right. You know, that's the whole thing. And not a lot of drummers around here.

Not to go off on drummers, but a lot of guys have dreams. John Bonham when they're 14. And however, what while would they were playing within their bedroom, listening to that stuff and the brass that they're hitting and all the stuff.

Not everybody is a pocket player or wants to be one. You know what I mean? Not every bass player wants to be a pocket player. They can fill a lot of space.

Not every guitar player on here wants to play clean. That's a whole nother animal. Right, right, right.

You know, so a lot of great musicians, but not everybody wants to play kind of in that avenue, you know, so it's really hard to find. But I, the last cats didn't want to, you know, and I did. And I'm like, ah, you know, I'm gonna find other players and great players, great drummers, great guitar players, great, you know, a little bit of everything, pedal steel players.

So I just bring in, I have a bench of everything, you know, these two of those four of those. Right, right, right. You said, you said you're a classic rock guy.

Yes. Then how'd you go? Why'd you go country? Man, that's a great question. So I, I, we talked about this a little bit last time.

I toured my whole life for 40 years, right? You know, so started in the 80s with Aria Sweet Wacken was my first national tour. Wow. Believe it or not.

Can tune a piano, but he can't tune a fish, right? So, and I was working for the opening act. Then I was a guitar and drum tech at the time. Okay.

And a good friend of mine, Porky was his name. He's from here. He was their main guitar tech and pyro guy and everything on Ario.

And it brought me out and I did that tour. Sure, sure. From that point, I was out with Ted Nugent.

Then I went out with Ozzy Osbourne was with Randy Rhodes up until the accident, you know, and so I did classic rock. You're right. He crocus.

I toured with a whole bunch of rock bands and classic rock bands. Right. Right.

And, and before that. It's like a guitar tech and stuff like that. Yeah.

Yeah. Right. But I played in the clubs before I was old enough to drink because at that time it was doing the slide between, you know, 18, 19, 21, 18, 19.

Remember it was going back and forth. I was playing in a lot of clubs when, when it changed and changed back, but they knew me. But then I got this tour in 1980 with Ario and moved on.

So I did that. And then I went out with, in fact, I got this from James Taylor. I went out with James.

Oh, no kidding. Yeah, I did. He's pointing to a bolo tie.

Yes. So there's bolo, which I wear at every show because it's a good vibe. I got that with James.

Sold out tour. And I'm sitting on the side of the stage in a rocking chair, sold out every age of people and singing every song. And I'm like, wow, this is.

Isn't that perfect that there's a rocking chair off stage? It is. It is. I was thinking the same thing.

It seems like it absolutely. You can't have a James Taylor show without a rocking chair. There's one.

There's one extra flight case just for that. Yeah, exactly right. So.

You know, that, that is, you know, I have to ask you because people are, people are going to want to know this. He's a very private person in the public eye. What is James Taylor like? Well, I could, I can tell you this without really breaking too much stuff.

You know, he's got a life where he, you know, fire and rain, if you will, if you know the song, but now, you know, he's kind of a, you know, a really laid back guy, probably the nicest guy in the world you want to meet. I think we talked about this a little bit last time. I got this weird concept that God only gives musicians like this two of three things, either got personality looks or talent.

Yeah. I remember we did talk about that. Yeah, yeah.

So James has looks and great personality. Now his talent, obviously he's incredible singer, but those songs he's singing came from Carole King or other people written by other people. And he's a troubadour.

He delivers this music at such a level that, I mean, I get in chills. Think about it. Right, right, right, right.

And probably the most, the greatest show, cause I also toured with Carole King and once it was her birthday and we were at the Beacon in New York and James came in mid song at, you got a friend, you know what I mean? Right, right, right. I mean, place is just electric, but greatest guy in the world carried his bicycle, go out riding bicycles, you know, sit at dinner, you know, talk and just, just a great guy, you know, and everybody in the band, the best of the best, you know? So, but after that James experience, I went out with Bruce Hornsby in the range when his record popped, right? Right. You're talking just the way it is.

Yeah. And so that was unbelievably on a small tour and all of a sudden was the biggest thing and won the Grammys and did everything. And that was my first recording experience.

Oh, really? I grew up, when I was younger, I lived in like the Bloomingdale Roselle area and stuff. And there was Stratford Square Mall and Bloomingdale. Yeah.

And there was a Soundtracks recording studio where any knucklehead can go in there and pay $10 or whatever and pick out a song. And they put it on a cassette tape. Wasn't even, wasn't even CDs or anything back then.

And I was with a friend of mine named Anne Marie and she goes, you know, you could probably sing that Bruce Hornsby song really well. Right. So I go to Soundtracks and the first thing I ever recorded was The Way It Is by Bruce Hornsby.

That's amazing. And I still have it. I still have that.

That's awesome. Soundtracks. Bruce was the greatest guy in the world.

And that was my first time from being like in a club guy. And every once in a while, a band would mess with me and say, hey, come on out and play. Because I knew I played guitar a little bit and I loved it because I'd always be noodling and bothering guitar techs and stuff like that.

But one day, Bruce goes, hey, at the end of the show, we're going to play Defenders of the Flag. You come out and do a solo. Right.

And so George Minarelli was the guitar player. Right, right. Great guy.

Went out with Bonnie Raitt for many years. He's retired now. So you're the guitar tech.

And I was a lighting tech. You were lighting tech. And for shits and giggles, they're like, hey, you're going to come out and rip a solo.

Exactly right. Wow. They go, guitarist behind the amp, hit this A-B switch and you're going to come around and go.

Right, right. And I go, we're going to rehearse this? Bruce goes, no, no, just go for it. Right.

So I was kind of excited to do it. What key are we in? Whatever. But here's what I was not prepared for.

I hit the A-B switch. I come around the side of the amps and all the spots hit me. And I'm in the middle of this sold-out show.

And I'm playing. I'm like, man, you're, you know, yeah. Shaking.

Yeah. You get that shake going. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You weren't prepared all of a sudden. Yeah. I'm usually on that end of that beam.

Right. Yeah. This was all easy until I got here.

Right. You better not suck. Right.

You know, so I'm playing and I'm just like, you know, it really throws up. But Bruce is laughing so hard. He's like, go again.

Go again. What, what, what, what, where was this? What was the venue? Oh, it was somewhere down south. I can't remember.

You know, I don't know, Florida somewhere. Yeah. Arkansas or something like that.

I was just trying to gauge, trying to gauge, like you said, sold-out show. How many people were you, were you staring at at that point? Oh, probably only about two or three thousand. You know, maybe a sold-out theater show.

A theater type. Reeling it back a little bit. I haven't heard anything about country.

All right. Yeah, because I got 40 years of road stories. Yeah, yeah.

So what got me in the country? I got off the road and just as you guys know me from last time, I'm a name dropper. So, you know, 40 years of touring, but the last tour I was out with was Paul Simon, right? You know, so maybe 14 years or so with him. I get off the road and this guy, a bass player calls me up and he goes, hey man, there's this country cat and he's looking for a guitar player.

You'd be the perfect guy. You know, and I'm like, get the hell out. I'm not a country guy at all, right? You know, but, you know, many years with great players, you know, Bob Dylan for many years, Sting for many years, a lot, so many killer guitar players and stuff like that.

I kind of get the tones, you know, Mark Knopfler, the whole thing, you know. So I clean up and I learn the music and I go to the rehearsal and the artist turns to me and he goes, you got the gig. Wow.

And I'm like, damn, now I got to learn all these songs. Who's the artist? His name was Matt Boone. He came out of Nashville, got his record deal and did, I told you this story last time, but he did his showcase at Loretta Lynn's house, right? Okay.

And he's singing and some girl comes up to kiss him and his wife jumps up and beats the shit out of her. I remember that. He loses the deal and everything, right? So he ends up coming up here to Wheaton and shacking out with a girl who's married to her now, a really nice woman.

She runs a huge thing at Grand Ole Opry. Every year, a lot of the artists around here, down there, that Nate Vitale guy or whatever his name is. Nate Venturelli.

Yeah, but he just won the award with her, the Josie Awards. Anyway, Matt is married to her. Okay.

So, and Matt is the one who hired me, right, to get in there. And he goes, man, you know, this is this classic rock thing. Everybody brings their Chicago blues, classic rock sensibility to the country.

You know, you're the first cat that brought the tone, you know, like, okay, great. But I said, I can't do this on my own because there's a lot of musicians. I mean, in the music, you know what I'm saying? A little acoustic, a little of this, a little of that.

So I called up another guy that they had auditioned, but didn't get the job, you know what I mean? But I'm like, hey, dude, if you come in and, you know, do solos or whatever like that, I'll, you know, take this part. You take that part. We'll divide and conquer.

And actually, Leo, who just left Hillbilly Rockstars, he was in Two Beer Tommy with me. And then he got poached by Hillbilly. And he just got let go.

Nothing, Leo, I just saw him the other day at a show. But we're going to be playing together in some other projects. So nice.

Yeah, yeah. So we poured the country on and learned that. But that's a whole different style.

You know, you start playing, you start getting clean. And I'm not the greatest guitar player. But when you're playing like that, it forces you to be a better guitar player.

Oh, of course. You know what I'm saying? There's nothing, there's no way about it. So you're a move of the safety net.

Yeah, exactly right. You know, and I absolutely love the journey. So I love picking up the songs.

And I don't care whether I like the song or not. These songs wouldn't be popular if there wasn't something to it. So once you get in there and there's always a little something, a little thing here, how they phrase, how they built on this chord or do this little lick or whatever like that.

So I've just been absolutely loving the journey. Yeah, yeah. And then playing with other musicians that are picking up on that.

But not everybody picks up on it. You know, some cats come in and they're, and I respect them totally. They're going to play their style.

They're going to listen to that song and play it their way. They're not going to play to the music. They're going to play their thing.

You know what I mean? Right, right. Your Honor, I have no other questions. Yeah, no, it's, and I totally get it because, yeah, I love playing distorted.

But man, to me, there's nothing like plugging into a, my 68 Custom Deluxe Reverb with a compression pedal to get that, you know, to get that poppy a little bit, get that pop sound, that Nashville setting on the compression pedal and get that. Yeah. I got a little Memphis slapback and a little compression, and you can do that for the most part.

And then, you know, real, you know, a little light breakup or the amp just on the edge of breakup, you know what I'm saying? And, oh, that's glorious, you know? But let me tell you something. When you're trying to clean pick and do stuff like that, you know, you can't hide. No, no, no.

I make mistakes, you know what I'm saying? But the more I try and the more I'm doing it, the more, the better I get at it. Right. And I'm one of those players, you know, it's not about me, but it's all about me today.

Right. But I'm all I ever think about, guys. I'm sorry.

So, but I'm one of those guys. And around here, I really find this to be the case. So many great players.

And because so many players play with their Chicago sensibility, which is killer, but as they get their amp and get their liquid solo sound, and then they roll off their tone just a little bit, but it starts to get a little muddy and a little pulled back. Right. You do, you don't, yeah, sometimes you can do it right.

Right. But not everybody does, you know what I mean? So they're killer players, but it's a little kind of muddy. It ain't clean.

You know what I'm saying? Right, right. But so I'm trying to do that, the clean thing. Yeah, right.

No, I totally get that. Well, what I was going to get to is people always say, I always get guitar players that are better than me too. So they can always play like Nick.

They play circles around me, right? But at the end of the show, someone will come up, your tone was unbelievable, man. I love what you're doing. So I can still hang with people just by my vibe or just trying to capture the tone.

And most people are not thinking about their overall tone. They're going to play and bust your face open. Right.

No matter what the audience thinks. Right. Right.

You know what I mean? But you want to sit there with your girlfriend and have a few drinks. And if you want to enjoy the music, great. And if you don't, that's great too.

But it's great or good, you know? Right, right. I want to play at that level. Right.

And not everybody wants to play at that. Right, right. And I don't mean that's up here, down here.

I mean, it's a difference between volume and loudness. Right, right. You know, that makes sense.

I had a guy tell me one time, you know, I play with a lot of really good guitar players as well. The guitar player in my band is excellent. Oh, it's phenomenal.

Yeah, you know Scott. He's fantastic. And I used to tell people all the time, I wish I had half of his knowledge of the fretboard and half of his speed.

Speed is one thing that's always eluded me as a guitar player. And I had people, it's overrated. I'll tell you what, there is no sweet picking in country.

Right. Oh, I know. These guys do these beautiful things and it's, I just love it.

You know, let me give you a good example. Steve Vai, incredible player. Right.

I love, I can watch his videos all day long, but I can't put a song on and listen to a whole song of him playing. It's not musical to me. But how he plays, I wish I had one quarter of his talent.

The ability to be able to do that. So I'm more a slow hand player. I can't do all that fast, licky kind of stuff.

But sometimes people gravitate that you were the guy not doing that. You know what I'm saying? You ever listened to John Five? Oh yeah, phenomenal. His country stuff is unbelievable.

That's what I was getting at. He's got that guitar virtuoso, you know, reputation kind of thing. But listen to his chicken picking stuff and it's absolutely amazing.

He can do it all. It's unbelievable. Yeah.

He's a fantastic guitar player. I love listening to him. And you know, my favorite guitar player is Leslie West.

Unbelievable. Leslie West used to purposely try to play slower than what he thought he should be playing. Totally.

One note at a time. And let's let that note ring out until it's lost its own energy. Now let's go get another one.

That's the David Gilmour thing, right? I mean, what are you going to say with one note as opposed to Yngwie with a thousand? And I'm sorry. I would rather listen to David Gilmour hold the notes than Yngwie. And nothing against all my Yngwie friends and fans.

But after a while, it sounds like a guitar lesson. And I love the guys that could do it. I can't.

You know, I'm quite honest. So what was the, when you started touring, what was the first job that you got? Well, National was REO Speedway. Was REO Speedway.

And what were you on that tour? Were you there? I was a guitar. I was with the opening act called 707. It was.

Okay. And you were a guitar tech. Yeah.

So how does, how does somebody acquire a job like that? Because I know there's a bunch of people out there. It's like, man, I want to be a guitar tech on a, on a tour. How do you, how did you get that? Well, as I said, Porky was the guy out there and I was a guitar player in the clubs.

So if you're a guitar player, you understand the basics of that. And these roles are always needed. Most guys are friends of the artist or whatever like that.

Okay. But all the big bands now use two techs. Okay.

So I have many friends that are out there as the alternate guy. And why they need two techs is because the amp systems, most of them, if they're playing tube amps are boutique and they're blowing up and doing their stuff. So one guy's working on amps.

Right. One guy's working on guitars. You know, I went to Stones the other day, but only just to peek at gear.

I didn't want to stay for the show because I've done some killer stone shows. But a friend of mine is the lighting director. He's like, Oh, you're going to stay for the show.

Aren't you? And I'm like, yeah, yeah. But up on stage, look at the guitars. And then there's those two, what were they? Fender, I can't remember.

Twins. Right. But the serial numbers were written on them.

001, 006. Right. You know, now these things, you know, the wiring's not the same in it anymore.

Right. And then there's another two behind it. You know, 632 and 427 or whatever.

You know what I mean? And the rack. And then 30 guitars. I mean, he pulled out 10 guitars during that show.

Everyone was just like, Oh, you've got to be kidding me. Yeah. I mean, just the best of the best.

So there's a cat just taking care of that. Another cat taking care of this. Of course.

That's kind of where I was going there because I've had people, you know, say stuff. Just, you know, I can play guitar and stuff. It'd be cool to go on tour and do this.

And I look at the guy and I say, yeah, but I've been telling you for two years now to fix that scratchy fucking pot you've got on that guitar. I mean, and you can't do that. And that's a great thing because alchemy.

And I build all my own stuff. I don't build my amps. I love Mesa.

I love Fender. I buy those. But all my guitars I build.

Yeah. You know what I mean? I mean, you've got the talent and the ability to do that. But there's a lot of guys out there that don't just because they can play guitar.

You know, it doesn't mean that they can. No, but my point is with the scratchy pot and all this other kind of stuff. I'm kind of baffled by guys that can't set up their own guitar or take a screwdriver or change their pots or solder stuff up.

I mean, you really should be able to do that much. You really should. If you're going to be an electric guitar player.

Yeah. Otherwise, you're spending a lot of money. Yeah.

I mean, it's crazy to do that. Every spring, your neck is going one direction. You got to pull out the, you know, truss rod.

That's right. Yeah. You got to know what to do.

Next fall, it's doing that. You know, your frets are popping out. But a lot of people bring me their guitars, too, and I'll work on them.

I don't mind. That's what saved me during COVID. In fact, I wasn't really playing during COVID.

I hung a shingle because I was out of work and just started taking people's guitars because everybody was dusting them off and taking them to play. Yeah, that's what was going on. I did really good, you know, and then started playing out.

And service is getting expensive now because if you go on the internet, you know, there's all kinds of schools you can go to. Now they've given guitar techs a fancy name that begins with the letter L, and now all of a sudden they got to spend. To be a luthier, you have to know how to build a guitar from scratch.

Oh, right. You know, like an acoustic guitar or a flamenco or a classical guitar. You got to have a pile of wood.

Right. You got to know how to build it. That's a real thing.

Like, oh, a doctor. Absolutely, absolutely, absolutely. But a guitar tech like me, a nuts and bolts guy, but you have to understand intonation.

You've got to make it right for the artist. I mean, I know how to work with a soldering iron and all that stuff. And the artist is going to look at you and he grabs that guitar.

It's got to be there. Right, right. You know what I mean? So, you know, of course, otherwise it's coming back at you.

And it ain't pretty. You know, you lift your head and all of a sudden, whoo, yeah, something. Yeah, yeah.

Better get him another one. And you've done it and you've done a bunch of different stuff. You went from guitar tech to lighting tech.

And I mean, you've done everything. Yeah, I started lighting. I got an offer to do Loverboy and Santana.

And at the time, Loverboy was the biggest thing in the world. So I took that gig. Yeah.

And it fell through. Okay. So I had nothing to do.

So I took a gig as a lighting. This is probably about what, 88, 88 to 92, somewhere around that era? Like 84, 85, you know, and then started at upstaging, which is where I work now. That's where I just drove from in Sycamore.

Okay. Huge lighting company. It's, you know, and I want to sound boastful.

It's like a Mercedes Benz of lighting. So, but right now in the shop I just left, I'm prepping, or I say I, but the crew chief and the crew were prepping Kings of Leon, right? That will go in Austin next week and a world tour. But, you know, this is the American leg.

So I'll fly down to Austin with those guys. They'll set it up, make sure everything's good. But I'm probably working on 10 tours at a time every week.

Right. So while I'm working on regular tours, I also work on my wild world business. Sure.

Nobody knows. I mean, you're not jumping on a tour bus yourself anymore. You're just kind of working out of the shop here.

I got a call the other day to fly to China to do a John Legend show. Shanghai observe, go to Hangzhou, get it working, fly back. So in between shows, my weekend shows fly to China.

I'll do this. I'll come back and then I'll be at Bob city. So you don't sleep very well.

But listen, this is the thing. This is why I wear people out. I toured for 40 years.

Yeah. So five shows a week is normal. Yeah.

Right. So when I'm doing my three show a week thing like I'm doing here. Yeah.

So I work seven days a week, right? Because I'm at the shop five days a week. Right. Putting shows together.

Right. And they work seven days a week that they don't stop building. Sure.

The world I come from the show world, which you guys are familiar with. I have to explain this to my wife. Listen, I got two days of the week, Tuesday and Sunday.

You know, I'm either working or not working. Right. And it doesn't matter what day of the week that is.

Right. She'll go, well, you're doing a show. It's a Sunday.

No, it's a show day. Yeah, that's right. And when I was on the road, you know, it's not like it's a holiday or your birthday or whatever, you take something off.

That's got, it's either a show day or a day off. Right. Typical tour is two days on, one day off, three days work, one day off, you know, so five days a week.

And, but it doesn't matter what day that is. Yeah. Right.

Sorry. Right. That's all I've ever done.

So you've, you've had a, you've had a crash course over the course of your life on pretty much how to run a band and put it, everything together. This is a great point. And this is why we're here up folks.

Sorry. I bored you for all the first 20 minutes. No, not at all.

This is exactly what I'm here to talk about. Right. And we touched on this last time, my 40 years of experience and $5 gets you, can't even get you a cup of coffee at Starbucks.

Right. Right. But it's, it's an interesting place for me to be because all day long, this is what I'm doing, talking to the artists and the bands that most guys dreamt about being in that position.

Right. Right. So, you know, I toured with the Eagles.

I spent months in rehearsals. I toured with Sting. I toured with Bob Dylan.

I toured with Paul Simon. I mean, I could go on for a long time, Clapton, Beck, you name it. I can explain to you what they were doing in their process.

I can explain to you what's going on right there. But the guys around here, it just sounds like bullshit. You know, so I try to take people with me to shows.

Like I took a guy that I played with Saturday night. I took him to Windy City Smokeout so we could watch a real country thing, you know, because I do a lot of country artists and I supply the lights for that show. You know what I mean? So I'm in that environment all the time.

But I cannot translate that environment to this, and I don't mean here, but I mean like to club level or to my basement band level. When I go, OK, well, here's what the cats do. Here's what we do.

I get a big roll of the eyes and now you're full of shit. You have no idea how this thing works around here. Yeah, this is a Madison Square Garden, asshole.

This is a basement. Yeah, right. Exactly.

And so it's very, you know, a little frustrating for me. You know, I got to kind of let it go, you know, because I'm treating it like that, you know, and I'm organizing it like that. And you're going to get your set list with the times and when to show up and be here and do this.

And you're still going to call me and say, is there food and where do I park? Yeah, you know, I said, I bet you there's an email that you got. Yeah. Have you read that thing? I bet you there's all kinds of information in that thing.

You know what I mean? Like, yeah, good. You know it. Oh, man.

Yeah. So it's so it gets frustrating to you. So yeah, very much so.

So that's why I wear people out and that's why I keep running through them. You know what I mean? Until I can find the right group of folks, you know. So really, this is a little commercial.

Call me up, folks. Yeah, if anybody's interested, they want to play regularly, you know, go out and play some country and have a year for country. We can do some beautiful things together.

And the hardest one is front people to tell you the truth, as you know, being a front person, right? You know, somebody wants to bring personality. Some people can sing. But I mean, I've worked a lot of artists who can't sing.

I just went to all the Stones the other day. I mean, Mick, but there's, you know, 80,000 people having the time of their life because he can entertain, man. Well, that's the best entertainer.

That's exact. That's exactly right. I mean, it's front man is a much more accurate description of what the lead singer of a band actually actually does.

That's right, because you're not just singing and half the time you don't have to be great, but you got to be able to read the crowd. You got to be able to do things on the fly. You got to entertain with the folks and get them involved.

Come on, folks. You know, what are we doing? So I end up doing a lot of cheerleading and the other guys will get it. But some of the other folks, they just flat foot and read their iPads and like, wow, you know, you're listening.

To the Rock and Roll Chicago podcast. I'm Christy from Crime Cave podcast. I've had a huge interest in true crime since my days of watching marathons have snapped back in the mid 90s.

I needed an outlet to talk about the cases that have haunted me for a very long time. With each episode under 20 minutes, I shine a light on some of the most bizarre cases in the last 50 years. Join me in the Crime Cave.

Hi, I'm Rick Anthony. I'd like to thank my radio brothers, Ray the Roadie and Hollywood Mike for allowing me to tell you about my podcast, the Someone You Should Know podcast. We spotlight musicians, authors and interesting people.

And we like to say we're making a difference one artist at a time. The podcast is heard twice a week on Mondays and Thursdays. And you can check it out on your favorite streaming platforms and on the web at someone you should know podcast dot com.

That's the someone you should know podcast with me, Rick Anthony. Making a difference one artist at a time. You know, and on the other end of the coin, you know, you talk about the guys that you worked with, you know, you know, you know, Ray works with some guys that have toured nationally in the whole bit.

And I've worked with guys that tour nationally and everything. But then being at that level, sometimes they can't reverse it. Because I know when you're when you're playing a large theater, when you're playing a, you know, an amphitheater, right? You're not you're not trying to make everybody here in the first 10 rows dance.

All right, everybody, it's time to dance. No, you're not doing that. You're literally just playing.

And so you tend to lose. Okay, how do I get this crowd of 100 people get their ass off the barstool? You know, how do I do that? How do I get them to, you know, make them feel like they're part of the party? What you can see, you can see when you're connecting, because I got to tell you, you know, I like looking close and see what people some people dance. I like looking far.

And I love when, you know, for a while people are seem disinterested in their duties. But after a while, you'll see him kind of come around. And then you see the heads, Bob.

He'll see you in the back. And you know, you're kind of all right, I got him now. Yeah, I hooked them.

And then every show at break, I walk the room. I go to every single table. And it's easy for me because there's only three people at our show.

So I don't care how many people are. I go to every single table. I go around.

I say, hi, thank you for being there. And mostly it's out of stage fright thing, because most of the people that I think are giving me stink eye that they just don't care. I go and talk to him.

I go, I got to tell you what, I really thank you so much for being here. And then nine out of 10 times, he'll turn to me and go, man, you guys are right. Yeah, I really love this thing.

And it really breaks that thing down for me, because I'm sure I'm trying to win them over and they ain't getting it. But they're just like this. But yeah, right.

And they're right. They're in awe. I don't know about that.

They're in awe. But nine out of 10 times, they are really enjoying themselves. I don't even like country, but man, you guys are good.

And this is great. And I kind of really dig on that. So I'm addicted to the line dancers and to that.

So if you bring the respect to the music and you play the music and you do that in the venues, it can happen. The hard part is trying to find everybody that's on the same page that wants to do that. Some people just want to play.

Right, right. And not everybody's a listener. Right.

Oh, I know. Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So do you do any singing in the band? Are you just playing guitar? You are. You're doing some singing and stuff in the band. Well, gang vocals, for sure.

Everybody should be singing. I tell everybody, whether you got a mic or not, you got to be leading over the edge of the stage, you know, long neck, high school, whatever, whatever it is. You got to do something.

Yeah, you got to be. So, yeah, yeah, I tell you, you know, you got to have your core singers. If there's harmonies, you got to get those right.

That's right. Harmonies really make the band. But you got other guys in the band.

Just don't sing directly in the microphone. But look like you're singing anyway. That's exactly valid.

I don't even care if you don't get anything coming out of your mouth, but it better look like you look like you're having some fun or whatever. Yeah, totally right. And get everybody going with you.

Or, you know, let's get this business. But again, you know, I don't care if there's three people or 300 or 3000, but we're going to play it. We're going to play it like that, you know, because that's where you're going to cut your teeth and learn how to do these things.

I'll tell you what drives me nuts is these are paid rehearsals. Like if you can draw people and you know this, you play a lot of venues here. Some of these venues are saying, how many people are you going to draw? Well, I'm quite honest with this.

Nobody. Yeah, right. But maybe we will.

I'll surprise you. Maybe, you know, we'll bring in a bunch of people. It's great.

How many are you going to bring in the club? Yeah, right. Nobody, right. You know what I mean? Well, there's got to be a little give and take here.

Exactly. So if they have not done their part and they don't market and they haven't done anything to help support this music or whatever, I've got little sympathy for them, right? You know, but I am going to come in there and bring a show, right? Of course. And I'm going to play it like I'm at Madison Square Garden because I don't care because this is an opportunity, a paid opportunity to rehearse, right? So you think everybody else would be on board with you, right? Because when you get to that, like we're playing a big fest this Saturday, when you get to that fest, and I got another one where we're going to open up for Tennessee Whiskey.

Well, I've done this a few times. These guys are drawing thousands, you know, 4,000. They're killing it, right? Well, you got to entertain.

So you're not going to think, okay, well, I'll do it when I show up. No, if you haven't been cutting your teeth at all these other places and figured out your vibe, you ain't bringing it there. It's going to be you coming out from behind the amplifier and all of a sudden the spotlight's on you.

Yeah, right. Exactly right. You know, it's so, you know, anyway, you can't always explain this.

We all say yes and shake our heads. And sometimes I feel like the words dribble off my chin and just scamper away, you know? It doesn't mean that people react, you know what I mean? So we can all agree, but I don't really watch people's lips. I watch their feet, right? Yeah, right.

And that's what starts to change things, you know? Right, right. So you mentioned you've got a chorale of different musicians depending on who's available. Do you, but is there like a core group? Is there a group that you, like, I guess, who's your first call guys? Who's your first call people in other words? Well, am I supposed to drop names? I mean, if you want to, or do you have a crew that you prefer to call? You know, I don't know if you know Mario Massey at all.

Do you know Mario? I don't think I know Mario. He's from the Mad Fox days and Elmer. So a lot of the guys that I know from way back at York High School and Risk and Joey.

And yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm from that 70s, 80s. Gotcha.

The guys, right? So Mario is a few summers ahead of me, but he has a studio in Elgin. Okay. Mario Massey.

And there's a group of people that play out of there. So Gil is a drummer, studio cat. And he does a lot of things that I really appreciate.

Right. So he's a first call guy. Then there's another guy from a band called Davidson County, Tim.

And that band doesn't do a lot of shows. But man, is this guy great. Hard worker can do everything.

Right size, you know, just right kind of kit. Just plays it. Right, right, right.

And then Tim Reedy. He's still, he's playing with me this Saturday. Yeah, yeah.

I call him up. You got a TBT show? No. Will you jump in with me? Yeah.

Sings lower thirds. Always perfect. Plays right size.

And he knows my shtick. You know what I mean? He knows I don't like that airspace. You know, if it's a heavy song, I want that kick going for the next.

Right, right, right. I can't always get every drummer to do the things that I would like to happen. But Tim knows my shtick.

So all of a sudden it'll start happening. I'm like, yeah. Yeah.

That's great. So a bunch of that. Three steel players.

All of them are phenomenal. Paul Cristera. He's in Denver right now.

And then this other guy, Glenn D. Michelle. And then there's TC Furlong, which is just phenomenal. I don't know if you know TC.

Not personally, but I know of his work. Yeah, yeah. So, but he's an industry cat like me, an audio cat.

So we know each other from that side. But when you get some of these pedal steels coming and then, oh my God, it's glorious. No, it's country.

I love that. I love that sound. I really do.

Exactly right. And you don't get it around here. There's a lot of country bands, cover bands, and they're assimilating it with a keyboard or a backing track or something.

And there's just nothing like the sound of a real guy doing that. And I'll tell you what, that is my vision or my dream. You know, there's a real fine line around here between track and I get it because the average public really doesn't care kind of where that music's coming from.

But if it sounds like they expect it to sound, they're not going to judge it. Only musicians are going to judge it. That's right.

That's right. I know, I know. But the average public, the biggest bands around here are going to run track.

They're going to get the message standby and three, two, one, go. All this stuff is going on. And then there's a fiddle player, but there ain't no fiddle player in a band.

You know what I mean? But the audience doesn't care. They don't care. Right.

It's being delivered the way they want to hear it. Exactly right. So there's that, which I dream about sometimes, but not to that level.

Then there's the musicians that I'm playing with. And musically, when I've got six guys in a band, really can deliver that sound. Right.

Except for all those harmonies that you're talking about. Yeah. Right.

So, man, the real blend is to try to get someone that will trigger. You know, you can keep yourself up on time, but you have to have a good drummer and you add those elements in at the same time, but do it live and not do it to click or to track. If I could find those musicians, because the cats that professionally do that, that's how it's done.

Of course. I mean, I can't tell you how many tours everybody goes, oh, that's bullshit. But listen, when I went Paul Simon and there's a Brian Eno or a Fripp Loop or whatever in that song, that's in that song.

But it was the sax player that's got a laptop that triggered that. Or what I would sting, you know, they've got to sing clave or something off the side, the bass tech, you know, saying, we'll go, come on, free, free, set them free. And all the band walks up to the mics, free, free.

Okay, girls, I want you to do it. Free, free, set them. And when you love somebody and you hear free, free, well, that's the bass tech.

That's the bass tech over there, yeah. Exactly right. I mean, but it looks like the band's doing it.

It sounds right. The whole audience is going with it. The girls all sing in it and it's all together.

But those little extra elements are being added by somebody, right? You know what I mean? So that's like the right blend. That would be my dream to find cats that would want to be able to both play it and add those little, I call it sparkle. You know what I mean? We call it monkey G's.

So what do you have coming up for the end of November and December? You got some dates on the books? Oh, yeah, I've been through the year, but things slow down in the fall. And now what I'd like to do is do a clean sweep around. You know, I book usually 80 shows by February.

Okay, right. And I have most of the year booked out. And then in the summer, I keep some space because it's country time.

August, September, right? These country fests open up. And I've got my country fests coming up that we're doing, you know, but being a newer band, my bullseye always ends up out decal Cortland, you know what I mean? Out where the cornfields are. But the music plays really great out there.

Of course, yeah, sure, sure. You know what I mean? But the thing is to try to zero and pull it back in. But you can't do that till you cut your teeth a little bit.

So this band in eight months has done incredible. I mean, we've played all the venues that I want to play, but that's based off what the relationship we have with two beer time. Sure, right.

And people just know that if I'm coming or whatever project I'm bringing, it's going to be good. I'm not saying we're the greatest. I'm not saying but it's going to sound good.

You're going to have that experience, right? I know. And, you know, I love bub cities. I love carols.

I love all those venues, you know, are fantastic to play. So real fast. Yeah, go ahead.

The venues that call me early spring and I don't want to go inside, then I book them the last quarter. Of course. Right.

Right. So those a lot of these I had booked early, but I'm like, oh, no, summer's all full. Right.

Not really. But I got an October date. I got a November date.

I got a December date. Right, right, right. And I booked them early for the last quarter.

So, yeah, yeah. So social media wise, where can people find you? Um, Wildwood Country, you know, on Facebook. That's all I do is Facebook, you know, yeah.

So and I'm sure you probably have videos or something. Videos and stuff on there. Not a super a lot.

But, you know, I hired a photographer to come Saturday and mostly to do a press and promo shots for me because, as I said, I'm not much, but I'm all I ever think about. I'm here to promote me and promote. If anybody's attracted to doing this thing, jump on the bench, you know, for eight months, you'll get wore out and then you'll split, but you'll have fun.

Right, right, right, right, right, right. All righty. Well, thanks for coming out.

Thanks for having me, gentlemen. It's a pleasure to be back here. Yeah.

And I really appreciate it. Thank you. Yeah, we had a good time.

Good time. A lot of fun. Thank you.

Thank you. Well, once again, we have we have we have a second entry into our into our podcast world. But yeah, I tell you, I'm stories that those those on the road stories are fantastic.

He for just for 40 years, you know, I don't know if you caught when he said he was on tour with Paul Simon for 14 years. Yeah, yeah. That's amazing.

You know, we could probably do a whole other podcast with him. And I mean, it could probably fill up hours. Oh, yeah.

We were just walking out the door just now when I was checking to see if it was still raining because I was stupid enough to ride a motorcycle here today in November. In November. Holy cow.

Yeah, the there's a cheap trick. There's a picture from their like first tour is on one side of the door over there. And then our real speed wagon is on the other side.

And he's like, yeah, I was work. I worked with him when that was the show, Bill. Oh, and when that was the show, I was like, oh, wow, that's crazy.

Amazing. I mean, that's that's, you know, people think it's all it's cool job and stuff. It's a lot of work.

Oh, it's a lot of hard work. You're on the road for so long. You know, I did as as I was younger, I did.

I was lucky enough on a few shows where I knew a few friends that did it. And there were several times where I got called to. Yeah, I believe they call you the grip when all you're doing is dragging cables across the stage and stuff like that.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

You think, oh, this is gonna be so cool. Yeah, not really. That's no, no, it's not.

It's a thankless job. And I mean, none of none of them guys, unless they're the elite are even like nowhere close to being close to being millionaires. Oh, you're right.

You just get the opportunity to travel with these guys and be a part of that, you know, which is cool in itself. But yeah, to make a career of it, man, it's a long time. Yeah, but it is cool to get called up on stage to play guitar.

Yeah, it is. With Bruce Hornsby. Yeah, yeah.

It's got to be really cool. The bass player is easy top right now. He was in the same boat.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Hey, bass tech, get up here. Let's go play your plan.

All righty, then. Well, it's great to have him here. Like always, join us every Tuesday for another exciting episode of the Rock and Roll Chicago podcast.

See you next week. Hey, everybody, it's Ray the roadie. And this is Hollywood Mike of the Rock and Roll Chicago podcast.

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